Doug Riddell, Ohio DUI Lawyer Interview Transcirpt

 

RJ: Hi, this is Richard Jacobs with MyDUIAttorney.org, and I’m here with Douglas Riddell. He’s a criminal attorney out of Columbus, Ohio. How are you doing?

 

DR: Doing great, how are you doing?

 

RJ: Great. Thanks for taking the time. I really appreciate it.

 

DR: Yeah, absolutely. I’m happy to help.

 

RJ: What motivates you to become a criminal defense attorney, and why do you tend to work on a lot of DUI or OVI cases, I guess they’re called in Ohio?

 

DR: We have OVIs here in Ohio, and I think for me as someone who considers myself a professional, it’s amazing to me how there really is no, typical, prototypical defendant in a traffic DUI case, so you’re going to see a lot of people who have never been in trouble in their lives who are grandmothers, parents, professionals, executives, lawyers, stockbrokers, marketers, I mean, every level of person could go out, have a night out with friends or with family or a work function, and come home, have too much to drink and suddenly they’re looking for an attorney, and that’s kind of where I feel like I can help people, relate to them and kind of guide them through that process. For me, it’s pretty rewarding. Especially because I know I can usually get a good result for my client.

 

RJ: Right on, so how many years have you been working on OVI cases or DUI cases?

 

DR: I was a prosecutor for several years, and now I’ve been out on my own in a firm for about 4 years. So it’s been about 7 years.

 

RJ: Wow, so you said there’s really no typical DUI defendant circumstance, but do you see more first-time people or more repeat offenders?

 

DR: I would probably say that the majority of clients are going to be first-time offenders, and they’re the kind of people who take some initiative and look for an attorney or go seek this out. Some people, if you’ve gotten two or three, you’re maybe down on your luck at that point, so you kind of just stick your head in the sand and hope that it goes away. For the most part, people who get an OVI, they get one and that’s it. So I mean typically I’m seeing younger people, first time, and I’d say in the out of college up to their mid to late 30s range.

 

RJ: Of the people you see, do you think they know anything about DUI before they get one? Do you think that the public out there knows a lot about it or nothing?

 

DR: I mean, I think everyone has heard a couple things or they know a lawyer who told them to do this or not take the test or to not say this to the officer. And everyone’s seen the Law and Order kind of shows where they’re getting read their Miranda rights or my Constitutional rights, and so I think people know to some extent, but then again, there are so many intricacies to this area of the law that I think that there’s also a lot of misconceptions out there, people don’t understand.

 

RJ: And do people call it DUI when they see you, or do they call it OVI?

 

DR: People for the most part use DUI, because that’s just what they’re familiar with, but that actually leads to the conversation where they say, actually I didn’t charged with a DUI, I got charged with an OVI.

 

So they think it’s actually a different type of offense, and we explain to them, that’s actually the same thing. They just changed the terminology because in the past they used to consider it driving under the influence, now it’s operating which is going to classify a lot of different types of – more – it creates a broader range for officers to charge you if they didn’t necessarily see you driving or something like that. If your keys are in the ignition, that might be enough for operation.

 

RJ: Okay, I got you. So of the clients you see, do a lot of them come close to the .08 level, or do you see a lot of higher blood alcohol levels?

 

DR: Oh, gosh, I mean I’ve had the range from a .28 just came in the door actually a couple to a .002, a guy pulled over and literally had had maybe some mouthwash but had some leg injuries and got pulled over for a traffic stop, and suddenly is getting charged with an OVI. So it really does range all over the spectrum with me.

 

RJ: And then, you said there’s no common person that gets arrested for DUI, but are there particular circumstances? Do a lot of people say, oh, I was at the bar? Or do a lot of people say I was at someone’s house? Are there any commonalities there? Where they are coming from?

 

DR: Typically the client that comes in the door is going to be coming from a bar. That’s typically going to be the circumstances, especially here in Ohio where you’re talking about an area that’s more spread out than if you are living in an area like Chicago or New York City or something like that. If you’re out at a bar, you might be 10, 15 miles from home, so that leads to having a few too many drinks and then just trying – in this area, calling a cab is the way to go obviously, but it’s not always easy at 1 in the morning in Columbus, OH, or anywhere in Ohio for that matter.

 

RJ: That’s true. That’s true. So I guess, you tend to see more DUIs in rural areas or more city areas? Is there any commonality there?

 

DR: I would say more likely to be in the city, only because there’s more officers. And I think also that the officers in a Columbus or an area like that, Cincinnati, Cleveland, they’re going to be more business-like in their approach. They’re going to view people as a number. Whereas you get into certain small towns, and you might get pulled over by someone you went to high school with and you pat them on the head and say get yourself home. So I mean, that is something that happens especially more in the rural counties. But I mean you really could get one anywhere especially if you’re out one of the main roads. You’re going to run into a state trooper if you’re weaving on the road somewhere. In Ohio, state troopers have a presence all over the place, all over the state.

 

RJ: Okay, you know the cases you see, are you seeing more drug cases lately or is it still mostly alcohol?

 

DR: Mostly alcohol but there’s either some combo cases where you’re going to see alcohol and drugs. And there’s in Ohio especially now there’s a lot of these prescription drug issues, that we have going on. And I actually see a lot of those kind of cases now where you see someone who is clearly impaired but they don’t know what it is. And actually those can be in many ways more difficult for the state or the government to prove against someone because they don’t know what it is. And if they don’t take a urine test or even if they do, the evidence that you’re going to be able to introduce, a urine test into the court system is much more complicated than the breath machines that they use. So in many ways, if you get a drug charge for a DUI, it’s going to be an easier case to beat.

 

RJ: Okay, in the state of Ohio, has Ohio set certain limits for drugs whether they are legal or illegal or prescribed? If you have X concentration of this drug in your body, it means your impaired or not?

 

DR: As of right now, they have begun to do that. They have that classification for marijuana and cocaine, however some of these prescription drugs that are being used. And I feel like just about every person comes in the door these days was drinking but also had percocets or something else. Adderol. Or something that’s in their system that they can’t really classify because it’s not in the code at the moment, so that creates complications for police officers because it’s easier for them to be able to cite you a number and say look, the limit is this. You’re over that limit. You’re guilt. Whereas if there isn’t a number out there, it creates more gray areas as to whether – what the level is to show some kind of impairment. So it’s an interesting thing with drug cases right now.

 

RJ: So in the state of Ohio, are there any other unique DUI laws whether it’s in Columbus or the entire state?

 

DR: Well, there’s two tiers for an OVI as far as the breath test, as far as the legal limit. .08 is your low tier. If you’re over .08, you’re charged with an OVI per se. If you’re over .17 charge, that’s called a super OVI, which is a super DUI in Ohio, which is considered a high test which carries heightened penalties including additional restrictions on your license.

 

You might see people driving around Ohio with yellow plates, yellow color license plates, those are actually required for the plea to a high test OVI. Additionally you may be required to install a device on your car which is an alcohol monitoring device if you try to start your car, you’d have to blow into that just to get your car started. Those are the kind of charges that I’m always -- If my client is charged with a high OVI, I’m always going to try fighting that if we can’t beat the charges altogether.

 

RJ: I don’t know if you ever run into this, but what about immigration and DUI? People who are resident aliens or who are not full citizens? Have you ever run into cases like that? Does it have any effect on immigration status?

 

DR: Well, there’s been some research out there about foreign individuals who are undocumented showing that if you were to be arrested and become guilty of an OVI right now that is not going to be grounds for deportation in Ohio, so that is a good sign if you’re an undocumented person facing a charge like this. That it won’t necessarily, it’s not considered a crime of moral turpitude which is the standard, so there is probably good reason to think that if you do get stopped, it’s not going to automatically lead to deportation.

 

RJ: What’s your best tip? Someone’s driving, they’ve had one or more drinks, they’re in the process of being pulled over. Do you have any recommendations that they should follow?

 

DR: Keep driving. No. I would say first of all, you hear these stories, should I take the breath test? Should I not take the breath test? I think the rule of thumb is you should only take the breath test if you are 100% sure that you’re going to pass. Because there is such a thin line with these breath test, with these machines, and there’s so little that you can do once the result has been recorded in terms of contesting it.

 

Now there’s ways to test the calibrations of the machine and the records and anything else to try to pick apart the results of the test, but once they have that test, they can try to trunk that out as science. So I’m never – people like to hear numbers, and if the prosecutor going to try to throw out a number and say look, your client was a .14 test, you gotta really go the extra mile, which we do, to see if you can get that test thrown out, but I mean, at the end of the day, you can save yourself a lot of grief and usually get yourself a far better deal by not taking that test especially if you’re not sure you’re going to pass.

 

If you’re borderline, chances are you’re going to be over, and so you never want to give evidence to the police officer that they can use in court, whether that be a field sobriety test, admitting to what you’ve had to drink, if someone asks you, have you had anything to drink? And the person said I’ve had a couple. That’s an admission of drinking because in theory, if you said, no, then it’s your word against the officer’s. And no one really knows if you’d been drinking or not if you said no. So I mean, the goal of the case is to not give them evidence. It’s hard to do at the scene because you see those flashing lights and you’re scared. But if kind of keep your cool and remember that this is your interrogation, you can set yourself up for a good deal down the road.

 

RJ: Of the cases you deal with what kind of help are you typically able to provide to your cases? Are you able to more often reduce fines or jail time or what kinds of benefits can you tend to bring to the cases?

 

DR: Oh yeah, first of all I would say, when you are charged with a DUI or OVI charge, I would always say that it’s essential that you have counsel for the case because at the end of the day, your attorney is going to save you money, help you get through the process, they’re going to save you time, they’re going to save you from having to deal with the excessive punishments you might see, and chances are they’re going to help you get that OVI off your record, because ultimately if you’re a 21 year old or you’re a 24 year old, and you’re out of college in this economy and you have a DUI on your record and the other guy doesn’t or the other girl doesn’t, changes are whether it’s fair or not, you may not get that consideration. So you wanna have an attorney who can help you through this process and can advocate for you to help you get your charged reduced, and then not to mention the license stuff.

 

A lot of time in Franklin county or anywhere in Ohio, we’re going to be able to get a license suspension thrown out or reduced to try to help out this process. I mean, with regard to license suspensions, you wanna have someone who has a good relationship with the prosecutor down there and is going to be able to work something out in court to put your suspension on hold or terminated. If I can find a loophole or some kind of problem with the suspension of driving privileges, anything I can do to help the client. I think it’s always going to be a good idea to have counsel.

 

RJ: I know it’s hard to give a percentage, but generically what level of success have you had at mitigating some or all parts of a DUI case for a client?

 

DR: I go into every case seeing what I can do to avoid a DUI conviction. I think that’s ultimately, I mean if you’re hiring an attorney, that’s your ultimate goal. Obviously having an attorney is going to help you in other ways in terms of trying to get yourself from avoiding jail time or higher fine or longer license suspension, but the goal is to try to beat the case or beat the case down to something besides an OVI. I mean, I’d say these days I don’t know if I can put a percentage on it, but I’m going to say it’s a high percentage. It’s a percentage that I can be proud of that I think that if a client has a case where there’s something that I can use to exploit, either on the legal side or something that has to do with their personal history that we can kind of use our relationships to get a better deal with, for the most part we’re going to have success getting where we want to be.

 

RJ: Okay, do you feel like over the past 7 years it’s gotten easier or harder to defend cases? Has it changed at all?

 

DR: I won’t say easier, but I do think that once you have a presence in a certain courthouse or jurisdiction and you’ve been to trial and you’ve been to hearing and had officers up on the witness stand, that they know that you will go that length to advocate for your client. So you’re going to get a better deal because they’re going to know that if the deal’s not there that you’re looking for, that you will go. You’ll go all the way. I actually find sometimes that it can be easier now.

 

RJ: That’s good to know. I guess this leads into it, which you partially answered but what are the pros and cons of hiring a private lawyer vs a public defender vs defending yourself?

 

DR: Yeah, I mean I think that’s a great question. That’s one that I hear all the time. I mean, defending yourself, a case like this, if you want go down and plead guilty and get yourself the case over with, I guess, chances are you’re probably going to put yourself in jeopardy a little bit. You’re not going to get the right deal. You might cost yourself more money or longer suspension. Maybe you don’t have driving privileges in a quicker manner. Maybe you look back in three years and think I really should have fought that. I really should have seen if I could get that charge reduced.

 

I’m always going to say that it’s in your best interest to have an attorney. I’ve seen people walk up in court, plead guilty, and get sentences to jail. I mean, you’re putting yourself at risk if you’re going to go in there and just take it haphazardly. I think it’s always in your best interest to have an attorney. Now as far as a public defender is concerned, I have great respect for the public defender’s office. I had a brief stint there in my past, in law school. I know that they take great pride in their work but I can also say that they have a ton of volume. If you’re a public defender, you’re dealing with a thousand cases at a time and maybe you don’t have time to return a phone call for a week. Or you don’t have time to research the latest issues or whatever is going on or give it personal attention.

 

I think if you hire an attorney, you are letting the prosecutor know that you are very serious about getting this charge reduced. You’re very serious about having this charge reduced for you, and there’s some personal contact level that having an attorney you’re paying for the service that is always going to your benefit in my opinion, having seen all those perspectives.

 

RJ: Okay, very good. What have you learned about people’s behavior in their reaction to being arrested and prosecuted for a DUI? What human insights have you gained into the whole process?

 

DR: I mean, it is a high pressure situation, and so it’s kind of amazing that you see some people you’ll see are just calm under fire and other people have a complete meltdown. I think – and a lot of times you are talking about people who have had something to drink, so you can see the best and worst of people but at the same time, I always would advise people that it’s in your best interest to try to be as cooperative as possible with a police officer, even if you’re not cooperating with what they are asking you to do. If you’re cooperating in a manner that is polite and respectful, that ultimately will pay off in the long run of your case.

 

RJ: For instance, refusal if they say get out of the car and walk this line, instead of cursing at them, and you say I respectfully decline and say I don’t think that’s a good idea to do that. That’s probably the best you can do.

 

DR: That’s the way to go. That ultimately is going to get you a little bit better treatment in court when they mark on your report that you were respectful, polite and cooperative, even if you’re not doing what they want you to do. Even if you’re declining and basically giving them no evidence, not taking a breath test, if you’re doing it in a polite manner, that will help you in the long run. Usually the clients that are the most destructive with the officer are usually they are the ones who are going to get – the ones who are memorable for the officer – you don’t want to officer to really remember you that well.

 

RJ: Have you ever had any cases where the person was perfect? They gave no evidence, they said just about nothing, they did everything that they’re supposed to do?

 

DR: Yes, many times I’ve had that which is great, but I’ve also had situations where someone thought that’s what they did. They didn’t think they gave them anything, and then we go and watch the video and find out that they actually did everything. And it didn’t go well, so..

 

RJ: Oh, I see.

 

DR: Yeah, I have seen – I call the case where you really give them nothing, I call it the perfect offense because they really is no case if they charge you and you’ve given them no evidence of operating a vehicle while impaired.

 

RJ: Is there a particular story that you hear from a lot of the clients over and over when they come in?

 

DR: Just kind of going off the last question, actually the story I feel like we always here. We’re at the interview and they start telling us about their traffic stop and the field sobriety test. And when we ask them about the field sobriety test, the answer is always oh, I did fine. I did great actually. And then we go and pull the report and pull the video and the thing that’s interesting the clients don’t always understand what they’re being graded on.

 

It’s one of the only tests you ever see where you don’t know what you’re being graded on. So when the officers mark that you failed 6 out of the 9 clues, but you remember walking the line, and walking 9 steps and then walking back, and thinking it went fine, but in the meantime, you need to touch heel to toe or that you need to have a certain way to turn or you can’t lift your arms, and they don’t tell you all the various clues that are out there that they’re looking for, and even if you take all 9 steps great and you take 4 steps back, and you step off the line for one step and get right back on , that’s one clue even though 17 out of the 18 steps were right.

 

I always think that’s kind of interesting because people don’t really understand what goes into these field sobriety tests and what the science is behind them.

 

RJ: Do you feel that the current DUI punishments are too harsh or too lax, and why?

 

DR: That’s an interesting question. I think it depends on your perspective. I probably would say that I think that the majority of individuals who are charged with an OVI have learned their lesson tenfold by the time that they call their wife or girlfriend or parents to come and pick them up at the police station. And then to make them come back and have them deal with a suspended driver’s license and deal with a suspended driver’s license and possibly going to jail and doing all this stuff.

 

That’s a pretty significant punishment when you’re talking about other crimes that, in my opinion, can be more serious than that such as domestic violence or stealing or breaking into people’s property. There’s no requirement that they have to go to a program or counseling or have your driver’s license suspended for that even though they are arguably more serious.

 

RJ: And what do you see as OVI in terms of punishment levels and the number of people that get caught up in it?

 

DR: Well, I would say that both categories that you just mentioned I would expect to go up. The only thing that may change is if the technology changed, if we create cars that won’t allow you to drive if you have alcohol in your system. That would only be the only way I could see that would send the numbers down because the population’s growing, there’s more officers on the streets, these states want revenue with all the budget crises out there, so they have their cops out on the street looking to get DUIs so they can bring in fines and penalties to the state. As far as punishments you see Mothers Against Drunk Driving (MADD) and other groups out there, they’re certainly not advocating for penalties to go down. So I would expect that as we go along here especially in Ohio, I would expect penalties to go up.

 

RJ: What would you say makes your firm unique and you unique in providing DUI defense? What statement do you want to make to potential clients that are watching this video?

 

DR: First of all I want to say that I have handled thousands of OVI cases in my career whether it was from the prosecutor’s side of the defense side, so I’ve seen all different perspectives. I know the parties and the relationships with the prosecutors and the judges that is going to be necessary to effectively advocate for you on a case. So I think it’s important to have an attorney who’s going to know the law, who’s going to fight for you in the law, and is going to have good relationships with people to make sure that whatever deals and whatever possible options that we can take advantage of them.

 

I think that I can keep myself, do this work in a cost-effective manner, I think if you spoke to anyone I’ve worked with in the past they’d say that I treated them fairly from the price side. I encourage anyone to give me a call. I give my cell phone to any of my clients so I’m always available whether it be nights or weekends. I think that it’s a personal touch that has worked well for me through the years. I’d like to think that any client who’s going to call me is going to be one who refers me on to a friend.

 

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